There are more than a few reasons why Eddie Russell is a whiskey legend. Over his 45 years working at Wild Turkey, he helped guide the storied bourbon from the dark days of the ‘80s and ‘90s into a flourishing 21st-century renaissance. He kept the whiskey’s core identity intact while simultaneously championing innovation. He created beloved brands that have inspired worldwide fandoms. And he was named to the Kentucky Bourbon Hall of Fame in 2010.

Russell deserves every one of these accolades and honors, but he’ll never get away from comparisons with his dad, Jimmy. And he's okay with that. “Around here in Lawrenceburg, Jimmy was just the guy that kept the scorebook for the basketball team,” he recalled about growing up around the distillery, decades before bourbon fans began treating his father like a rock star.

Russell didn’t even think he wanted to work in the bourbon industry. “My degree was business. I didn't know exactly what business, I just knew that I wanted to get a job in a bigger city,” he said. “Nowadays I think that's crazy.” It took just a couple of weeks working at a summer job at the distillery to convince him that, actually, he wanted to work in the bourbon business—just like his dad.

With that decision, Russell diverged from his peers. “Most of my generation was like, ‘We don't want nothing to do with the past. My granddad drank bourbon, so I'm not going to drink bourbon.’” It set him and the distillery on a path so intertwined that, today, there’s no possibility of separating the names Wild Turkey and Russell. They are, for all intents and purposes, one and the same.

But that outcome wasn’t inevitable. When Russell formally started working at Wild Turkey in 1981, the bourbon business was in the pits. His dad, Jimmy, was 27 years into his career and watching distillery after distillery close. Yet Wild Turkey still found ways to thrive. The Japanese market, for example, was clamoring for well-aged bourbon, and made up a significant portion of Wild Turkey’s sales during those lean domestic years. Russell was working his way up during this time, learning from his father, and putting forth his own ideas as well.

Having been teased by old-school distillers and executives for putting ice in his bourbon, Russell knew that Wild Turkey could do more to welcome drinkers beyond the “Southern gentlemen” who were the target market of the time. That didn’t necessarily mean new ad campaigns or events. Instead, Russell thought about the whiskey itself—could he tease out different notes and profiles from Wild Turkey’s traditional bourbon?

With that in mind, he launched Russell’s Reserve—initially a one-off to celebrate Jimmy’s 45th anniversary at the distillery—in 1998. He didn’t change anything about production or maturation; instead, he chose barrels that emphasized sweetness and caramel over the peppery spice of Wild Turkey 101. Russell’s Reserve was a hit and has remained so, evolving into a core lineup of 90-proof 10-year-old bourbon and six-year-old rye, plus annual releases at 13 and 15 years old and the Single Rickhouse series. Single barrels are typically regarded as exceptional, and certain limited editions, especially the 1998 vintage, have become highly desirable among collectors. 

Eddie was named associate master distiller in 2008, and finally achieved the master distiller title in 2015. As bourbon re-established its popularity in this century, Russell continued to create new products that honored tradition while gently pushing the boundaries, especially through the Master’s Keep series. And he’s been preparing the next generation too, mentoring his son Bruce, who currently holds the title of associate master blender.

After nearly half a century, Russell could be contemplating retirement—and he admits that spending more time with his grandkids is a priority. But Jimmy has never retired, and Eddie is likely to follow that example. “I don't think there'll ever be a complete retirement, but I think there's a lot of stepping back, letting Bruce spread his wings a little,” he said. “We've got a bunch of coals in the fire right now, so you'll see some good stuff coming out in the future. And hopefully we won't change anything, or Jimmy will haunt us for the rest of our lives.”

The Unicorn Review talked with Eddie Russell about butting heads with Jimmy, bringing the eight-year-old age statement back to 101, and serving Wild Turkey with ice cream in South Korean malls.

This interview has been edited for length and clarity.

The Unicorn Review: Your first job at Wild Turkey was supposed to be just for the summer. When did you realize that you actually wanted it to be your career?

Eddie Russell: Within the first two or three weeks. It just felt so natural for me to be there. I was a union employee. It wasn't like I thought, “I want to be Jimmy someday.” That came several years later. I had become a supervisor. I went to him and I said, "Someday I'd like to be you." And he said, "Which one? The engineer, the plant manager, the human resources?" And I'm like, "No, no, none of that stuff.” I wanted to be the man that made the whiskey. That started that progression.

It took you 34 years to actually be named master distiller, though.

I could have taken that title many years before that, but I always thought of it as there should only be one master distiller, and I think Jimmy felt the same way. People kept saying even back in 2000, 2001, when he turned 65, "When's Jimmy going to retire?" I knew and our family knew Jimmy would never retire. And he still hasn't.

There came a time when Jimmy couldn't travel anymore, he couldn't be the face [of the brand]. That's when they named me associate master distiller as the first step in becoming the master distiller.

The Japanese market made up a big part of sales during the '80s, ‘90s and 2000s. You sent a lot of higher-end whiskey there. Did it end up being a kind of proving ground for the American market?

The first time I went to Japan was 2003 or 2004. We were releasing a 17-year-old for Japan and we'd never done anything like that for the US. I kept questioning Jimmy, why don't we do one? It was actually 2007 before we ever did.

The main thing was you couldn't sell a bottle of bourbon for over $100. It’s hard to believe nowadays, but I think the first one he did was American Spirit, which was the first bottled-in-bond we ever did, and it was like 89 bucks.

We didn't even realize at that time who was buying rye. We just thought it was those really older gentlemen.

Wild Turkey was one of just a handful of distilleries that kept making rye whiskey from the 1970s until it started coming back in the 2010s. Yet Jimmy famously disdains rye. Why did he still produce it?

Just being the traditionalist he was. The bourbon drinker was the older Southern gentleman, they called him. But their fathers, they grew up drinking rye because that was the first American spirit.

At the beginning, [the distillery was] buying rye from Pennsylvania, Maryland, and a little bit out of Illinois, until the mid-’70s when [those distilleries] died out because there wasn't that much being made. We started making our own. We made rye one or two days a year and really didn't even sell all of that. And then as the bartending community started realizing those original cocktails were made with rye, Wild Turkey 101 was the rye that stood up in the drink.

When rye started growing [Wild Turkey’s stocks were squeezed]. We decided to go with 81 proof and cut off 101 for a little while to try to catch up. Eric Castro, a bartender in San Francisco, actually started a Facebook page that was basically, "Let's fire Eddie Russell, he's made a terrible decision." Chicago guys really got mad about it because they depended on that 101 rye. They refused to even use some of our other products because of it. 

A lot of writers said, “Rye's going to overtake bourbon.” I never thought that way, but I thought rye was important, so we made a lot more of it, especially for that bartending community. You just don't see too many people sitting down drinking rye neat—except maybe Bruce because he loves rye so much.

I love 101. I think it's the best thing out there for the price as far as quality and age

Bourbon has become much more inclusive during your career, in terms of both people and products. You’ve played a part in that. Can you tell me about it?

When I look back at Jimmy and Booker [Noe, Jim Beam master distiller] and those guys, it was like, "Here's my product. If you don't like it, don't drink it." I didn't quite feel that way. I felt like if you don't like it, we had some amazing whiskey that I think you will like.

I love 101. I think it's the best thing out there for the price as far as quality and age. But my taste profile was a little more... you call it elegant notes or higher end notes or different tastes, which is what Russell’s started with. More of the caramel, more of the sweetness.

I traveled 150,000 miles a year in the US and overseas, meeting people that thought 101 was too strong. It used to be one of my favorite things to see at Whiskey Fest. People would come up to your booth and say, "I can't drink that 101, it's too strong. But I love Rare Breed," which was seven or eight proof points higher. But Rare Breed also was very small batches of barrels that we'd picked out to give it more of those chocolate and tobacco tastes that were a little smoother and easier to drink.

I think as long as you're honest, everything's good to go.

Back when you started, a lot of people in the business were aghast that you put an ice cube in your bourbon. Those attitudes have largely changed. But are there any whiskey rules that you think should never be broken?

I think as long as you're honest, everything's good to go. When I put that ice cube in there, I thought, we're limiting ourselves to just a small group of people. All of us advertised and promoted in this little circle, but Julian Van Winkle was the first one to say, "No, I want to move out” to what he called an intellectual hub, which was New York and Chicago and California, which most of the bourbon producers didn't even think about. They thought about Alabama and Georgia and Louisiana, the top half of Florida, and Texas, which was always one of our biggest markets.

That was really the beginning of my thought of why are we in this closed box? My generation didn't want to be in that little box. We wanted to expand outside of that box and see what we could reach.

Could the industry do even more to be welcoming to people who don’t think bourbon is for them?

Keeping your eyes and ears to the ground, which is something that you have to do in any business.

In South Korea they're still big into the malls and dressing up and going and walking around. We set up this sort of tavern down there and we offered three shots of Wild Turkey with a scoop of ice cream, just to bring people in, thinking, "Man, this is different. Let's see what this is like." It was really neat to see as young women came in, couples came in, and anything new was exciting to them.

South Korea was a very small market in 2018. We grew by 300% in three or four years.

Back when I started, there was a lot of whiskey passed around from distillery to distillery.

Vintage Wild Turkey, like Cheesy Gold Foil and Donut, is in high demand at auction. Do you think people buy it because they believe the whiskey was better back then?

I think it's the nostalgia. I mean, you weren't near as consistent back in those days. I always loved Cheesy Gold Foil, but they weren't very consistent. Some were amazing; some were good, but not amazing. Nowadays we make a lot more consistently good whiskey.

When I started in the distillery making mashes, it was a steam-driven chain that stirred our mash tubs. You cooked the corn for 20 minutes and if somebody come up and started talking to you, it might be 30 or 40 minutes. Or running the still: You might've wanted to hurry up and get done that night, so you sped it up. I don't think our yeast was quite as consistent because we were handling it ourselves. Nowadays, White Labs does it. It's a lot cleaner, a lot better taken care of. Those things are going to change flavor.

And back even when I started, there was a lot of whiskey passed around from distillery to distillery. When somebody had run low, they'd buy from others. It still happens today, but it’s not as prevalent as back in those days.

So in some older Wild Turkey bottlings, there could whiskey that was made somewhere else, like at Beam?

Not at Beam, but I'll take the Fifth on anybody else.

Do you have any thoughts on the crazy money people spend on old Wild Turkey?

It is crazy. When we were doing 12-year-old in the US, it was about 45 bucks a bottle. A lot of people liked it, but they weren't willing to spend that kind of money back in those days. I remember even in the early 2000s going out on the West Coast and walking into a liquor store and this guy had three old dusty bottles of Cheesy Gold Foil sitting there. He offered them to me for $20 or $25 a bottle because he couldn't sell them. I think I did buy one of them, but I drank it. I have that same thought as Jimmy: We make it to drink. We don't make it to save.

To this day, I don't really collect stuff like that. I have a few older bottles that Jimmy did back in the day. The thing is, everybody gets mad because the price is going up. Our first 13-year-old was $89, I think, [It was actually $69.99 - Ed.] and then the next day it’s on the secondary market for $250. As a company, you’re going to look at that and go, “I’m charging $250 next time.”

Will we see any correction to that trend of flipping and driving up secondary pricing?

You see a little bit today, but it’s still pretty strong. We’ve started doing things to help with this. Instead of just saying, “Our new 13-year-old’s going to be released at the visitor center tomorrow,” we’ve started doing events [with staggered bottle releases throughout the day]. People were lining up out on the highway, cars parked everywhere and lines running forever, and then they finally get in and buy a bottle and then walk back through the line going, “Even though I only paid $150 for this, I’ll sell it to you for $300 and you don't have to stand in this line." That really caught our attention.

I mean, we'd give our employees bottles of good whiskey and we told them you cannot sell these on the internet. And next day they're on the internet, just under somebody else's name.

We make [whiskey] to drink.

Do you have a crazy collection of your own?

I have a little room above my garage, I call it my little man room. There's maybe 10 or 15 bottles sitting over there that are older, that Jimmy did back in the day. And some we did for Jimmy's 45th and 50th and 55th anniversaries. But everything else has been opened up.

I'll probably keep a bottle of the new 13-year because it's a tribute to my 45th year. But my one son doesn't drink at all, and Bruce gets the same things I get. So who am I saving them for? I'm not going to go out on the market and sell these to people for these crazy prices unless I go broke one day. But hopefully that doesn't happen.

To me, we make it to drink. When my friends look at a bottle sitting up on that cabinet and it's 15-year-old or 13-year-old or whatever, and they're like, "Can we have a taste of that?" I'm like, "Absolutely, let's have a drink."

You brought back the eight-year-old 101 last year, after it had been discontinued in the US since 1992. What’s the significance of that?

For me it was huge. Bringing back 101 at a price that was affordable to anybody was big for us because we wanted people to see what Wild Turkey was always about, what built that brand. At first, it was talked about just being released for Jimmy’s 70th anniversary, but then it was like, let's just keep doing this. We've got the stock; we can keep going. 

Has the Master’s Keep series wrapped up? I heard that Beacon would be the last release.

Right now, yes, because Bruce has his series that he wants to do [the Austin Nichols Archives Collection], and he's getting introduced to the world as the next Russell down the road, so I think it's time to stop on that. Not saying it'll ever be the last one. I still don't have my 75 years in like Jimmy does.

The Master’s Keep series was very special for me because it gave me the opportunity to innovate without changing. We didn't change Wild Turkey 101. We didn't change Russell's Reserve. It gave me an opportunity to release something on a limited-time offering. There's been some of them that maybe we should have kept around, but they would've been at a very high price and I wasn't looking to do that. 

You could just quit paying Jimmy. He's going to keep doing what he’s doing.

Wild Turkey is so closely associated with the Russells, but y’all have never actually been in ownership; you’ve always been employed by whatever company owns the distillery. As creators, do you ever come into tension with corporate interests?

Those battles happen constantly. You have to be able to sit and explain your reasoning behind everything. I've told people for 30 years, "You could just quit paying Jimmy. He's going to keep doing what he’s doing.”

We're very simple folks here in Lawrenceburg. It didn't matter that we weren't the owners. We were the caretakers. We were the people that were fighting not to change the recipe or not change our yeast. There were things that did happen that we didn't agree with: take an eight-year-old statement off and use a little younger whiskey in there at times and things like that. 

You have to be able to explain those things to people. We’ve had some really good companies own us, but it’s very hard for them to understand because a lot of liquids you can make today and bottle tomorrow. We don’t even think about the next four years—it’s too late. We’re thinking about 2040 right now, believe it or not, in our long-term forecast.

What about you and Jimmy—have you clashed at work?

I think we butted heads almost daily because I was the guy thinking different than he was. Booker was famous for saying, “Here’s my whiskey. If you don’t like it, send it back and I’ll drink it,” and Jimmy felt that same way. 

Me, it was, “Yeah, I’m not going to change what we’re doing, but we’ve got a million barrels. They all taste different." Take the 17-year-old Bottled-in-Bond, which is one of my favorites. Jimmy said, “That won’t work.” The sherry cask–finished. “That won’t work.” We battled along those lines.

I can never fill Jimmy's shoes. You have to just slip them on and make your way without hurting what was done in the past.

People sometimes refer to you as being in Jimmy’s shadow, although I don’t think that’s fair to your accomplishments. Now Bruce is coming up behind both Jimmy and you. How do you think he’ll distinguish himself?

For me, Jimmy was the man. It never bothered me that even though I was doing the work, Jimmy was always going to be the man. I just wanted to put out good whiskey.

Bruce was the first one I ever heard say that at Wild Turkey, we have Jimmy Russell whiskey and we have Eddie Russell whiskey, because they have a different flavor profile. I never thought of it that way. I just thought of it as all Wild Turkey.

Bruce has that charisma that Jimmy always had. Maybe not at that stubborn edge as much, but he does great in public. He's a natural speaker, which I never really was, so I think that's going to be great for him.

I can never fill Jimmy's shoes. Bruce can't fill mine or Jimmy's shoes. You have to just slip them on and make your way without hurting what was done in the past. That’s what I've always preached to him. Don't ever change 101. Don't ever change Rare Breed. Russell's, I'm happy for you to come up with new ideas and new concepts as long as you're not hurting what Russell's 10-year-old is. I think that's really helped him understand that he can experiment and innovate without being in trouble because Jimmy's not around to holler at him like he did me.